EPISODE SUMMARY
Hello, This is Sirisha, welcome to my podcast!
Have you ever wondered how to make a career pivot from your corporate job to pursue your passion? Hetal Vasavada talks about how she made the transition from the Heath sector to being a baker, the blogger who has been featured in magazines such as Bon Appetit and walked the red carpet. She has grown her Instagram followership to 108,000 followers and has built an active, engaged community. Her first leap of faith came as a contestant on Season 6 of Master Chef but it has not been easy sailing. She has learnt a lot of new skills, done a lot of heavy lifting and constantly edits and revamps her strategy as she runs into roadblocks. She talks about how she has got paid clients and how her values help define her and her business partnerships. We also segue into sustainability and fast fashion as we touch on culture, being immigrants and children of immigrant parents and how we straddle both worlds. We briefly touch on microaggression in the workplace and toxic cultures that can exist. This topic is going to have to be deep-dived in a separate podcast episode to do it justice.
Hetal Vasavada was a contestant on Season 6 of MasterChef and is the founder of the blog Milk & Cardamom. Her recipes have been featured in the Huffington Post, TASTE and The Times of India. She also consults on recipe development and content creation for culinary businesses. She lives in San Francisco, California.
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Below is a transcript of the episode, slightly modified for reading.
PODCAST TRANSCRIPT OVERVIEW
[00:00] INTRO [Jump to section]
[00:44] Meet Hetal Vasavada... The reality star... career pivot.....tiny steps to build a platform. Microaggression in the workplace [Jump to section]
[10:11] Freelancing...Content Creation. The heavy lifting [Jump to section]
[14:11] Growing your social media presence...developing a persona [Jump to section]
[18:35] How to align your values and know your worth... with your Social Media Sponsorship & Partnership - The power of saying "No"[Jump to section]
[20:51] Aligning with your values [Jump to section]
[22:55] Sustainability... Repurpose. Creative Reuse...Upcycling clothing...Mom's closet. Thrift...Fast Fashion[Jump to section]
[25:18] 21-Year-old self... Pivots take you to unexplored amazing destinations [Jump to section]
PODCAST DETAILED TRANSCRIPT
[00:00] INTRO
Sirisha: Hello everyone. This is Sirisha and I host the women's career and life podcast, just like you. I've travelled way with parts, stumbled a little, picked myself up and learned a great deal on my journey. Many of us face similar questions, but we don't always get to have a conversation with our friends or peers. In this podcast.
You will hear real stories that you can connect with on the challenges of navigating a career in life. You must be wondering who I am. In my everyday life. I'm a carrier woman, a mom, and an ever-reader. I'm also a road tripper, amateur Gardner, and even a fashionist Easter, some days join me and my guests. As we have an open and honest discussion on career change, trade-offs and working across boundaries.
[00:44] Meet Hetal Vasavada... The reality star... career pivot.....tiny steps to build a platform. Microaggression in the workplace
Sirisha: You get the idea. It's a perspective you simply may not hear anywhere. I am excited about today's guest. Hazel Vasavda, is an author, a cook, and an entrepreneur where more important. She was a season six master chef top contestant. She's pivoted her career and has a huge following on her blog and Instagram platform over 107,000 followers. And she's written a cookbook which has been featured in Bon a Petite and also in Food and Wine. And she writes articles in these magazines, including the New York Times. Her journey's amazing. We were just chatting a few minutes ago and maybe I'll splice those in, she's going to a premier tonight first one, for a movie.
And it's really exciting how her trajectory has changed. The reason we are also having this connection today is reality. Talk about mid-career pivots because this has been quite significant.
She's the first content creator that I've got to talk to. And she's done a complete career from being in the tech space to moving into content creation engaging a lot of people and providing such great value. This was by no means an easy journey and Hazel talks about her many steps, the things she had to learn along the way, and the mistakes that happen. And a lot of the heavy lifting that she has to do as a content creator to get fair. She is. She's also figured out how to gauge her self-worth and the power of saying no sometimes so that she can continue to align with her values. The hotel you started is a corporate carrier, so maybe you can walk us through what your journey's been so far.
Hetal: So I went to school for biochemistry and did my master's in Biomed with the intention that I was gonna work in a lab. And I did, I worked as an analytical chemist for a couple of years in a laboratory. And I hated it. Tremendously. And I ended up deciding, okay, maybe I'll go to the admin route in healthcare.
So I worked at Columbia university medical Centre as a reporting analyst for some time and realized that I hated it. One because in the lab. Throughout college, it wasn't very, it's not a strict nine to five because you run an experiment. And then while the experiment is running, you have time to do your notes and write down your stuff. You have a little bit of free time. And I realize desk jobs. They just expect you to be at the desk from nine to five, regardless if you have enough work to fill that time. So for the first three months of my job, as soon as I was done with my work, I would leave.
Sirisha: Okay.
Hetal: and then one of my coworkers was like, oh, why I noticed that you leave early every day? Why? And I'm like, oh, I just finished my work. And then I go home what am I supposed to do? Sitting here for two hours? very true. Corporate perceptions are different expectations. I know being extremely efficient, and productive is not the same. Having FaceTime. Yeah. So I think, as I realize like really quickly in the corporate world, they value FaceTime over productivity and efficiency. And I like the lab, it's very much about efficiency. Get your stuff done, get your experiments, running, and get like what you need to do. And it wasn't like, you have to wait, it's not like you can run your next experiment. You have to wait for this one to be done, to move on to the next.
I, it just wasn't clicking. So my husband my boyfriend at the time was working in consulting, which I had never heard of consulting before. I had a pretty narrow idea of what a professional career could be. And it was very much like Dr A lawyer engineer. Because that's all I ever knew. I had never met any consultants growing up. And he's oh, you get to travel and you work on different projects and it's fun. So I got a consulting job and moved out to San Francisco and it was fun for a while, but I started running into a lot of microaggressions and like kind of it, end all be all racist behaviour. Things like, oh, your tights don't match your skin tone. Oh, very strict. Yeah. Your hair looks messy today. I got engaged and married during that period at that company. And they were like, oh, why can't your wedding be just one? And even though I accrued the time, they wouldn't give me time off for my wedding.
And then I thought it was like, oh, they just, cuz I was like one of, maybe three people of color in a company of 500. I was like, maybe they just don't know any better. So I like brought a sheet explaining like this is what BT is, this is what the sung this work, whatever. And she starts crossing things out and asking me if I can move things into the same. I'm like, are you kidding me?
Sirisha: Right now. Yeah. I'm not anything like that.
Hetal: At the time I was young, so I didn't recognize it as something that's like one I could have sued them for discrimination, but two as so wrong. And all my coworkers are also super young. They're like 20, like fresh out. I was the only person at the company that wasn't fresh out of college. And I had a couple of years of work experience behind me. And none of them saw that as like problematic and it made me angry and a lot of it, what I am doing is like cooking and baking a lot to bring myself some sort of joy. It was like the only moment that I like had control and felt good. And my husband noticed that I like just hated my job. And the fact that I was being labelled as problematic, because I was asking for something that I had earned, but two, like they couldn't culturally fathom. Like it just blew my mind that people could be like, Especially at a big company. He was like, just quit. So I quit and I spent some time travelling with him cause he was still travelling quite a bit. And then he was like, why don't you try out for master shop? Like you clearly like food. You're good at it. I had been blogging for a long time. I had, I was running a blog throughout all these jobs, but the blog was mostly for me. It's not really for anyone else... And he's he pushed me to try out for master chef. And mostly because I didn't have the confidence to start my own food business, but two, because I didn't know where I stood. Am I good? Or my friends just, blowing smoke up my butt, like. Where am I, this was a good way for me to figure out where I was and where I fell in the skill level. And when I came off master chef, I had a whole new confidence. And I knew very early on. I did not wanna own a restaurant. There are many ways to be in the food industry. I did not wanna be in a restaurant. It is not conducive to family life. It is hard work. And I was like, I don't wanna do that. I wanted to go into rescue writing recipe development. So I started doing that for a lot of meal kit startups, cuz being in the bay area, it's the Centre of all these startups. And I was very lucky that like when I came off master. All these meal kit companies were coming out and I started writing for them word came out and I started writing for more than just milk, like food startups too. And I also grew my skill set for social media. Cause I knew when I came off as a master chef, if I wanna be in food, I need to keep my momentum going. From master chef. So I focused a lot on my social media making sure I was like live tweeting and posting on Instagram and just sharing as much as I possibly could. And that turned into a skillset. Then I started doing social media and digital marketing for restaurants and food, startups and businesses. And at my height, I had like about 15. Whose social media channels I was running? And then the pandemic hit. I lost all of my clients and I focused on myself, on my bakery, cuz once I left that corporate job, but once I got off master chef, I found out the day, the episode that I got kicked off aired, I found out I was pregnant. And I had a really bad pregnancy. I was sick for pretty much all nine months vomiting, pretty much like 10, 12 times a day. My life shut down and then I wrote my cup and went back to work. So I worked at a food startup as a social media manager.
Then started freelancing, cuz I hated working like it felt corporate to me even though I was a startup. And I wrote my cookbook as soon as I left that startup and started freelancing. I didn't think the cookbook was gonna give me as big of a platform as it did. Like I didn't expect it to go on the New York Times or anything like that. Cuz it's such a niche subject. Like Indian sweets and it gave me a lot of opportunities. After it came out, being able to start my, business starting my bakery, cuz a lot of the baked goods I sell are from my cookbook. and now I run my Instagram account. I do business consulting for food startups, and other entrepreneurs I write for recipes, for food and wine have one in this month's issue for food and wine for Bonne Petite and King Arthur would all sorts of stuff. But I feel like It all started with reality TV, which is the weirdest way to ever pivot a career.
Sirisha: But I think, I would like to spend some time maybe we'll redo it another time when you're talking about the microaggression in your career and corporate life, that's a whole other piece to just discuss. And I'm from the South Asian community as well. I came here for graduate school.
So I think being an immigrant woman of color, certain things are different. No matter how you think you blend and meld and everything, there are certain things that you may not realize you don't know which lens you're looking through. So it's a challenge because you're culturally taught to talk and, come across a certain way and then to learn, to figure out how to use your voice and say, as you said, you didn't know you had some. Probably depending on which PLA or which culture you grew up in, you might be different. And you said you knew only lawyer this, and it's very much a part of the Dipo on what are the expectations? So that's a whole other discussion. So maybe we'll do that later, but for today's thing, I wanna touch, as you said, you used master chef as a launch platform.
[10:11] Freelancing...Content Creation. The heavy lifting
Sirisha: Yeah. Some of it makes it sound easy, but by no means, does it sound easy. It sounds like a lot of work. And there are, we all get avenues. We all may have opportunities like that, but to convert it into what you did is amazing. You knew that you needed the social media skills. You not only practised it on your platform.
went and exercised it very heavily. In other avenues, you took that same thing. You tried, again, the corporate thing you knew you liked, I think over time, you figured out what it is that you're good at, that you like to do and that you don't want to do. And from everything I know and I've known people in the restaurant business, the chef's job never ends. It's hard work, heavy lifting, and a lot of strain in based even if you look financially, depends how the profit margins do not. So it's a lot of work. Something challenging. And with COVID and everything is just, highlighted a spotlight on how much more harder it is. I heard a radio talk show yesterday about inflation, and how it's impacting them even more because they are a little careful about increasing the prices. After all, if they increase the prices, people may rather eat at home, but they're paying the cost for it. They're in a double bind at this point and it's very hard. But, I wanted to spend some time when you made the switch. Your husband's boyfriend at that time was a huge support for moving you forward, but there's one part of it. Before we talk about mid-career pivot. When you move from corporate to freelance. what were some of the doubts you had and what were some of how did you navigate? Did you have familial and societal expectations? Because that's part of the thing, right? No matter if it's a career transition. There is so much just sniping the card and deciding to take a leap of faith is very hard, especially when there is no net to catch and it's not already laid out, even for a corporate change within a corporate space is hard. So, this is even more challenging. So maybe you can speak...
Hetal: Yeah, it's scary because when you go freelance, you don't have a consistent income. One month you might make, $2,000 another month, you might make $10,000 another month. You make nothing like it is inconsistent, which can be very anxiety, inducing and scary. The other thing is you're constantly trying to sell and get new clients, and books and show why you are the expert and why they should go with you compared to another freelancer. So like you're selling yourself, which means again, you have to have a lot of self-confidence. You have to have a little bit of ego.
You have to be able to woo talk. You're your salesperson. You're your marketing person. You're an accountant. Like you're doing so many different roles and you have to be good at it. Everything cuz you are really bad at one of those roles. Your whole business can fall apart. Yeah. You're in like you're chasing people that haven't paid you, you're doing your bookkeeping. You're also trying to like, oh, let me worry about my SEO. Let me worry about writing. Let me create content for my social media so I can get more clients. Like it's a lot of work cuz you're wearing so many hats. When it came to family stuff, they weren't as nervous. I think one being Gujarati is pretty like we're pretty entrepreneurial folks. like having our own business is like, That seemed as oh yeah, that makes sense. So it was never really a big stressor for my family to see me freelance and go off on my own. I was more stressed and anxious, but the only way I. I waited. So when I was working for the food startup doing account management and social media stuff I took on some clients and I asked them like, is it okay if I have some clients part-time and they said, yes. So I took on some clients through social media. I like two at a time. And I kept them. And once I was able to build. My confidence in them. And then they referred me to other restaurants and I got enough that I could quit the main job the startup job. That's when I went full feet into freelancing. So I did it in the most cautious way possible where some people might just quit the corporate job and then start trying to find clients. I had already gotten two clients and was like working towards gaining more before going that full paycheck.
[14:11] Growing your social media presence...developing a persona
Sirisha: So you've only established your brand in a way and people are advocating for you because they know what you're capable of and what you bring to the table, which is amazing. because when you look at your website and for those who follow your Instagram profile, and if they haven't, they should go and check on milk and card it's to me it's just beautiful. I'm a passable cook at best and not at sweets, but just the picturesque nest of it. So there's one is, of course, the food, but. You must be a photographer, an artist and everything, because have you presented how it comes across your gulab jam bun cake, which is I guess, a clear feature, right? A unique feature that you've done. So how did you transform and how did you acquire the social media skills? You're talking about that being the skill set that has helped you prevent not just your food business, but how did you go and develop those skills? So for someone who wants to get into it is a lot of hard work. How often do you post how do you? Plan your content. And how do you generate revenue from all of these business ventures that you're looking at? So initially, I started doing social media, like I normally would do So like I would post whenever I wanted.
Hetal: If you look at my early photos are terrible. I still, to this day, don't have consistency in posting. I post whenever I want. I've learned. Trying to be consistent has led to me being burnt out. Cuz then I'm consistently trying to I need to come up with three rescues this week. I need to come up. And it's becoming, it was burning me out to be that creative. It was stifling my creativity as weirdly as it sounds, cuz I felt like I need to put out content it was quantity versus quality at that point. But I did do a. Udacity digital marketing course. And that taught me just like how to do Facebook ads and Instagram ads and Google ads and things like that.
But when it came to social media, the scientist in me came out. I would do experiments oh, I'm gonna use these specific hashtags. I'm going to tag these specific people. See how this works. And. Do AB tests and try to figure out what works and what doesn't work. And then I would apply it to my Instagram and if it worked, I would then apply it to my clients. I noticed at a certain point that brands that had a voice had much more followers and more engagement. And when I say a voice, they have a persona, right? As you think of Wendy's on Twitter, it's sassy, maybe mid. You teenage girl type of vibe that you get, right? Like they have a very unique voice and you know exactly who they are. And then I would create these voices for these brands. So one brand that I worked with was Humphrey Slum, and they had a sassy vibe. And I put like a Facebook and it's, a punk rock drag queen that does not care. We curse. This is our voice. And this is how we're. Move forward with it. And it worked like, we grew our following people wanted to know not just what kind of ice cream my client was putting out there, but also what's their opinion on what's happening in the world and you're seeing it now. It's now 10 X that now you go on TikTok and you have the dual lingo L is like one of the most famous and the dual lingo L isn't just sharing like how to learn a new language. Fun Mees and trends. Like I like to watch and find these patterns and figure out how to make them work for my clients. The other thing with social media is building community. So like identifying you, the people that are always commenting, the people that are always working with you that are always buying and creating that community where you can chat and they feel like open to sitting, hit you up in your DMS and chat with you and creating that kind of space. And I think it's just, cuz I'm a very extroverted person. The pandemic changed me a little bit. I think I've gotten a little bit more introverted. but for the most part, I'm pretty open and I love talking to new people I think taking that enthusiasm and applying it to social media worked for me very well.
Sirisha: So you've combined your research hat with your personality and brought that persona to not just yourself, but the clients that you work with as.
Hetal: Exactly. And what type of content works best? Do people like the food porn shots, like the egg oozing out and like the string cheese and all that stuff? Or are they like, do they wanna know who are the people behind the restaurant? You try to understand what the community wants and then cater to that. And the only way to do that is to identify patterns engagement patterns, and things like.
Sirisha: And there's a lot of trial and error because you don't wanna be a copycat of someone else's, that's already trending though. You may take parts of it and yes. What you are in that space, still holding.
[18:35] How to align your values and know your worth... with your Social Media Sponsorship & Partnership - The power of saying "No"
Sirisha: There's a lot of talk about purpose and values and culture, right? For any organization or anybody who could be an influencer, who's running a corporation as well. And how do stay aligned and decide what those are?
Hetal: It's easy, especially on Instagram. I have multiple income sources, one of them being Instagram, sponsorships, where I get sponsored to usually it's like food brands that they'll pay me to create recipes and content for them that I posted on my Instagram. But I learned that over time I learned the power of no and saying no, initially when I get started, I think this happens to a lot of Instagram food bloggers or anyone that enters Instagram and get some sort of following. You start saying yes to every. And also you'll say yes to anything, cuz you're just so grateful that a brand wants to work with you. So you'll do work in exchange for a product or you'll do work for really low rates and you don't value your time or your effort or all the years that it took you to gain those photo skills and content-making skills and social media skills and gain all the years. It took you to gain that community that they're paying you to, create content for. You undervalue yourself which I've learned in the last two years. I went from saying yes to everyone to now saying no, a lot more. If their values don't align with mine if their pay doesn't align with what I feel like I should be paid. I am very happy and content with saying. I'd much rather take five gigs for $10,000 each than 25 gigs for $200 each. You know what I mean?
Sirisha: You touched on so many things outside your food blogging that I thought were so relevant. You talked about burnout before, when you were just talking about constantly posting on social media, as one thing you talk about that same sort of burnout. But I think with brands it's a bit of three things, right?
The power of saying no, which I was gonna ask you about. So I'm glad you already touched on it because that is very hard to do, especially when you are in the kind of field you are and where you're freelancing, right? Yeah. Defining what your worth is and what you're willing to give because people are probably looking at your Instagram profile and saying, oh my gosh, she has so many followers, but it was a lot of hard work, a lot of trial and error, a lot of sweat, probably some tears as well and trying to figure it all out.
And then just the self-care part of it and trying to.
[20:51] Aligning with your values
Sirisha: Understand, what is your risk and reward for yourself and align with your values. Because when you're freelancing, I'm sure you're trying to generate business, but at some point, all of these come to a head and you have to decide. You have your family and your doctor and others are very involved.
So between all of those, you're trying to see what is it that I want to pass down and finding your brand and sticking to your brand. Yeah. Pieces, all these pieces together, your value, your worth, what you're willing to do, how often you want to post and staying true to it. And even for yourself now, today, you're going to the premiere of so giving those opportunities, how do you continue to align with that piece?
Hetal: Like, me and my husband have a role. We have a, we will not work for assholes role meaning if there's a company that reaches out that I. That has questionable ethics, but they typically are the ones that are also willing to pay a lot of money. We always say no. Even when my husband was looking for a new job, he had an interview with Uber and I'm like, are you sure you wanna work for Uber? They've done some questionable things. And he is no, you're right. He's I wouldn't feel right. But even for me, you'll never see me selling lax of teas or some sort of weight loss thing or, it's just not me. my stuff is you make desserts, you make it for others. You enjoy it. I am not about restrictions or, the I'll never be like, oh, I ate a piece of cake today, so I need to go work out for an hour tonight. You know what I mean? I'm all about healthy portions. Enjoy it. And then move on. It's okay.
Sirisha:
Don't beat yourself up over it. Enjoy it. Exactly. Okay. It's let's go back to using your wedding as a reference it's a five-day event to just enjoy that is not the time you're going to go and say, do this or this, or, you know exactly. You're going to spend the time, family resources, money, everything just.
Bring everyone together and have a celebration.
Hetal: So exactly. There are different things I will work with brands that, align with my values. I'm happy to and find saying no to some brands that wouldn't fit me. I won't work with like fast fashion brands for the most part.
[22:55] Sustainability... Repurpose. Creative Reuse …Upcycling clothing...Mom's closet. Thrift...Fast Fashion
Hetal: I've had fast fashion brands reach out to me, but I always say no. I'm not a fast-fashioned consumer in general. Like I wear things till they die. And then I like also to shop a lot at thrift stores a habit that my husband was completely grossed out by initially when we started dating, cuz like one of our first dates, I'm like, oh, let's go to the thrift store. And now he's all for it. So I'm glad I like converted him a little bit, but yeah, I. Sticking to your values, you will never feel bad about yourself or guilty or feel like you sacrificed, a piece of yourself for your success.
Sirisha: You're talking about fast fashion and repurposing. When I went to India recently, I took my mom's stories and converted them into dresses, skirts, to like a whole set of things that I told her. Okay. I have three of them. I'm not gonna use up your full closet. Let's keep them for my sister or later ways. All of them are gonna look similar, but I got a whole slew of clothes just by reusing them.
I love that, and they've turned out amazing. found this amazing Taylor who I don't have the designer sense. So I told her, you decide what you wanna make and just I'll tell you what lent of it. It works. And she did such a fantastic job with it.
Hetal: That's so cool. My mom was a seamstress. And she takes all my old clothes and she makes clothes for Yala for my daughter. So like she made a bunch of Lang guys. And so AKA uses for her using all my old Garba outfits from like 10, 15 years ago. yeah. I'm like, even if I tried to put this blouse on, it wouldn't fit anymore. Like I can't save it. So she, she cuts them all down from and makes them for you, Laura.
Sirisha: it'd be nice for your daughter to see you wearing that old outfit. And saying, oh, here is the new one. I saved a few of my kids' clothes. don't know how to quilt, but I'm thinking at some point maybe make them a quilt out of, their favourite t-shirts, which are though, but who knows.
Hetal: Yeah. And then the thing is little kids grew out of their clothes so fast. So now all my friends and cousins have clothes that my mom made for Laura. And they gave you. I gave it to them, cuz it's hard to find cute lingo and stuff for five years and under cause. And even in India, they don't make really that many Indian clothes. They just have the cupcake dresses in that size, a little dress with lots of tools, but it's not like a Jo or. So far or nothing. So I give them to my friends and they have them and they'll pass it down to their friends until they like are ready and gross and need to go are ready to go.
Sirisha:
very cool.
[25:18] 21-Year-old self... Pivots take you to unexplored amazing destinations
Hetal: I'm in Los Angeles for work stuff going to the premiere tonight for never have I ever been on Netflix... I cooked for the cast a couple of months ago and they invited me. Very cool. So this journey of yours has transformed into something I'm sure. Did you expect any of this? Not at all. I am like, I would've never expected any of this. If you asked 21 year old, have all this, I'd be like what? You're going to red-carpet events. You're cooking for celebrities. What is your life? I'm excited, nervous, but excited. I'm going with a friend that I know on Instagram. That I've never a life. So this is just like one big networking event for me. And it's the first time you're going to something like this. Must have been a lot of fun because there's the shopping, you have to shop for the right clothes and everything. Oh yeah. I dress, I have a friend that's a makeup artist. That's coming to do my makeup and yeah. It's gonna be fun. Very nice...
Sirisha: I'm gonna look at your Instagram tonight to see how you showed up and have a blast at tonight's premier. That's fantastic to see what you have done and achieved for yourself. So amazing and good luck. Thanks. I appreciate it. I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I would love to hear your responses and what tips you take away. If you're in the freelance space or you're thinking of pivots on what you can give back. So you can always reach me by emailing me at womencarrierandlife@gmail.com.
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Guest: Hetal Vasavada
Instagram | @milkandcardamom
Blog | https://milkandcardamom.com/
Host: Sirisha
Instagram | @womencareerandlife
Twitter | @womencareerlife
LinkedIn | https://www.linkedin.com/company/women-career-anΩd-life
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